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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
 Posted - 13 September 2005 : 4:25:46 PM
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This coming Sunday the 18th of September will be the opening race in the new Yachting Division from the North Harbour Sailing Club. The start time will be about 10.30am.
The starting & the finishing will be in the area between the YA marks of Fairlight & Forty Baskets. All marks are to be taken to starboard unless stated in the Sailing Instructions.
If you are interested email or phone Chris Cope on 0416108639.
Chris. |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 13 September 2005 : 5:11:41 PM
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I agree with Leigh, if you were buying your personal Inflatable/Harness/Tether the Stormy Seas is the Rolls Royce and good value. Our crew all bought theirs 4 years ago and purchased Bourke with inbuilt harness. I was assured by Bourkes that they complied with the Aust Standard and I also have 7 normal safety harness on board. We use the tethers from the harness with the Inflatables in night races.
I must admit if crew want to race, especially Off shore their financial committment is not that overbearing.
Wet weather gear/boats/gloves about $450 to $500 for cheapies $1,000 for good coastal gear. Inflatable incl Harness $189. (excl Vic) Stormy Seas I think was about $400 but could be wrong. I would concider the Stormy Seas better value and or the built in Inflatable in the Wet weather Jacket. That is an enormous bit of gear.
So even if a crew member had to kick in $1,500 to kit themselves out it would be cheap compared to what the owner has to shell out. My crew are all kited out with their own gear.
Copie, enjoy your first race for the season in your '30 this weekend, I hope all goes well. We are doing New Members day & safety inspections. Our 1st race is on the 24th. Port Hacking to the Yellow mark in Botany Bay & return.
If there are any Endeavourer's who do not race their boats but would like to join an Off Shore crew, give me a ring 0429 904523 as we are still looking for about 6 - 8 extra crew for the fleet. Some really good boats but only one Endeavour "mine"
cheers,
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"Splinter" |
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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
Posted - 13 September 2005 : 6:14:13 PM
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Well it looks like I will be making a little trip to Whitworths tomorrow afternoon to look at the harness/eperb/life preserver gear as well as the other "bits & pieces" which we need. It is always an adventure to visit these places & I still have to visit the boat locker at Artarmon which has also been suggested. Thanks for all of your comments & recommendations.
Chris. |
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LCJOHNSTON
Helmsman
Australia
258 Posts |
Posted - 17 September 2005 : 9:12:38 PM
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All, Below is a summary of what I found last year with regard to harnesses and tethers. Unfortunately the small Excel file would not attach, so I have pasted this in (sorry about the formatting).
Leigh
PFD/HARNESS/TETHER ALTERNATIVES
STORMY SEAS INFLATABLE PFD/HARNESS OPTION
STORMY SEAS PFD YOKE (MANUAL) INC. HARNESS WITH CRUTCH STRAP, 2m TETHER WITH OVERLOAD INDICATOR YES $460.00 PRICE FROM PJ'S 1/8/04, LIST PRICE IS $515, WHITWORTHS PRICE $499. CONTRUCTION IS DOUBLE SKIN, WEBBING STITCHED RIGHT AROUND THE HARNESS, COMPLETE WITH CRUTCH STRAP AND 2m TETHER WITH OVERLOAD.
TOTAL $460.00
OMEGA INFLATABLE PFD/HARNESS OPTION
OMEGA PFD YOKE INC. HARNESS (MANUAL). REQUIRES CRUTCH STRAP TO BE FITTED PLUS SEPARATE PURCHASE OF 2m TETHER WITH OVERLOAD INDICATOR YES $166.55 PRICE FROM PJ'S 1/8/04, LIST PRICE IS AROUND $185.. HARNESS WEBBING GOES RIGHT AROUND THE PFD MATERIAL - LOOKS OK. IS STAMPED WITH EN396 PFD STANDARD AND EN1095 (1996) HARNESS STANDARD, SO LOOKS LIKE IT MEETS YA.
STORMY SEAS 2m TETHER WITH OVERLOAD INDICATOR YES $129.00 PRICE FROM PJ'S 1/8/04, LIST PRICE IS $144, WHITWORTHS $140
STORMY SEAS FIT CRUTCH STRAP TO AN EXISTING ONE OF THEIR PFD'S (I GUESS THEY WILL DO IT ONTO AN OMEGA ONE, OR SOMEONE ELSE WILL) YES $27.50 PRICE FROM STORMY SEAS 28/7/04
TOTAL $323.05
SEPARATE PFD PLUS SEPARATE HARNESS OPTION (INC. EXTRA 1m TETHER)
NON BULKY NON-INFLATABLE TYPE PFD1 NO $200.00 BULKY TYPES OF PFD'S ARE NOT ACCEPTABLE AT ALL, EVEN IF THEY HAVE THE CORRECT "AS" NUMBER ON THEM - RACE ORGANISERS WILL NOT ACCEPT ANY OLD STYLE LIFEJACKETS - MUST BE NEW FULLY FITTED TYPE. MOST CREWS ARE EACH BUYING THEIR OWN PERSONAL INFLATABLE PFD COMPLETE WITH INTEGRAL HARNESS (WORKS OUT A BIT CHEAPER)
BURKE HARNESS WITH 2m TETHER WITH OVERLOAD INDICATOR (CRUTCH STRAP IS IN A SEPARATE PACKET) YES $179.40 PRICE FROM PJ'S 28/7/04. (HARNESS TETHER $169.40, CRUTCH STRAP $10.00, HARNESS LOOKS TO BE IMPORTED EN1095 BUT MEETS ALL STANDARDS), BURKE DO NOT MAKE A 1m TETHER (ONLY STORMY SEAS DO).
TOTAL $379.40
UNSUITABLE UNITS
BURKE IWS150 MANUAL HARNESS WITH PFD - NO TETHER OR CRUTCH STRAP. THE HARNESS MEETS YA STANDARD (EN1095) BUT WEBBING IS NOT CONTINUOUS (IE; IT IS STITCHED TO PLASTIC PFD SURROUND) AND I WOULD NOT TRUST IT. ALSO THE PFD DOES NOT MEET AS 1512 (REFER WARNING IN THE WHITWORTHS BOOK)!!! YES $185.00 FIRM FROM MARINELINE 30/7/04 - BUT NOT RECOMMENDED!!!
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Leigh Ex E30 MkII "Caroline" Hobart |
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Sasha
Helmsman
838 Posts |
Posted - 17 September 2005 : 11:13:15 PM
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I am a little unclear and concerned about something.
The units that have the snatch tether "attached", does this mean that a tether is packed in with the unit as sold or that the tether is actually attached (stitched or in other ways permanently mounted) to the harness?
If so, then I would steer well clear. Modern specs call for a harness that has attach/detach hooks at either end. This is in the wake of a couple of catastrophes where a boat was capsised (the really bad case with broken mast and keel) and people that were held underwater by their tether could not release them at the near end to swim up. They were prevented by debris and panic from being able to get to the end of the tether hooked into a pad-eye (or apparently a knife) and were drowned.
I just like the clip on at both ends variety for the fact that I can pick between several lengths of tether, I even have a very short (about 8inches) one made from some rope and quick-release clips that I attach AS WELL as the proper tether. This acts as a third hand that gives me something to brace off in the area I am working. So you go up forward to wrestle with the furler drum or something, you are clipped on by the long tether and also have the short tether (the claw, as we call it)clipped on to the same ring on your harness. This gets clipped around the forestay just below the drum or such. You can now (within reason) use both hands to work and feel less like you are in a rodeo.
Just a thought.
Sasha
...I own the Victorian specced Burke PFD. I have no complaints about the webbing/harness setup.
Oh, one other thing by way of a P.S
Consider Nokia Wildthing, as an example, It goes at about 17 or 18 knots and if you go overboard and get snatched by the harness and towed along, it is still going to be going 16 or 17 knots....minus a small fraction.
Consider an Endeavour 26. It is going at about 5 to 6.5 knots...that is jogging speed on land. If you fall off and get snatched up on the tether, the boat is going to pretty much STOP. I do not say it will be comfortable (trust me on this one), but it will not be anything like getting dropped off the side of a racing maxi.
So consider whether you actually need the Formula One level gear and the pricetag that goes with it.
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The more I know about horses, the more I love sailboats.
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LCJOHNSTON
Helmsman
Australia
258 Posts |
Posted - 18 September 2005 : 12:17:27 AM
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| It makes sense what Sasha is saying about "Formula One" racing versus what might be expected in an Endeavour, however the YA rule book doesn't make an differentiation so far as I can remember. The info I posted above was from all the hours of investigation I went into last year to get the boat I was on up to Cat 2 for the Melbourne-Hobart. It was a 30 foot boat (in fact a little shorter than an E30). The new harness/tethers being a relatively new bit of gear (when the reg came into play for overload indicators in tethers about half thru to last rule book, few manufacturers could even make them!) it was still a minefield late last year. We needed to take care we bought gear that met all the standards (standards are different for tethers/harnesses and PFD's) - we found we could have been caught out if we hadn't looked carefully. I have only seen tethers with the special snaps on both ends, nothing permanently attached (would be dangerous as Sasha correctly says). The standard tethers are 2m long, but 30% of the crew must have another one 1m long. Again this is for Cat 1 and 2 ocean racing. Buy what suits you, the type of sailing you do, but make sure it fits the safety regs you need to meet or you could be back buying again. Anyone who has been washed back the full length of a boat along a jackstay or worse still over the side will attest that these are crucial bits of gear to get right. |
Leigh Ex E30 MkII "Caroline" Hobart |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 18 September 2005 : 07:16:23 AM
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Leigh, what you say is so true, I went through safety yesterday and with the new blue book (Regs) there are certainly a lot of new stuff. I only went for Cat 4 at this stage.
I think your warning about check all your gear carefully before you purchase anything and make sure it meets all the starndards.
I didn't have any problems although I will be off to the Chemist again this morning for a few minor items.
I also have a small list of recommended additions and modification to do. Not biggies as I agree with all of them. They will be completed this week.
Our inflatable vests were not in the Cat 4 safety but will be each of the crew own resposability, but it would be up to each skipper to check that they all meet the standard and are in current inspection.
Thanks for all the info re inflatables as I think I will upgrade mine this year to a Stormy Sea.
cheers. |
"Splinter" |
Edited by - Splinter on 18 September 2005 07:26:41 AM |
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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
Posted - 18 September 2005 : 6:03:26 PM
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This morning we started our first race with only three on board the Hagar IV. A little short handed but with the brains trust, old Pete. There were only two starters today & we gave the other boat about 20 minutes start on handicap. We sailed full main & No3 header. We were on there heals by the first mark, but Pete did not want a kite, the others launched theirs & sailed away when the breeze died out. We caught & passed the opposition by the second beat to windward & only when they were about to pass us in the run to the finish mark would Pete allow me to hoist the No2 kite & we got a reading to 10 knots surfing down a wave in the sound. An nice afternoon of conservative sailing. Rod will be in Brunei tonight.
Chris. |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 18 September 2005 : 6:24:45 PM
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Sounds like you have had a good day, 3 only for crew is a bit light to set the kite but I would think you would have been busy with the kite up with the gusts. Sounds good, we have our first race next Saturday. Port Hacking to the Yellow mark in Botany Bay. Will check it out for the Booze cruise the following Friday afternoon. Will try to leave a stubbie on top, should be cold enough for the first around the mark on Friday arvo to have a beer on the way back.
Heard today of another '30 up on Yowie Bay, will check it out.
cheers, |
"Splinter" |
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LCJOHNSTON
Helmsman
Australia
258 Posts |
Posted - 18 September 2005 : 9:24:06 PM
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Down here in Hobart we have three major clubs (two side by side on the western shore near the Casino, the other on the eastern shore).
My club (Derwent Sailing Squadron - one of the ones on the western shore) runs a series before the season opens properly (opening day 1st October - hundreds of boats out, with a sail past and salute taken by the Governor on his launch).
The series is called the "Pipeopener" and is usually contested by 50-70 yachts. It is is held this weekend just gone each year (16-18 September) and consists of three races.
The first race is an oven nighter starting in Hobart (this year starting at the normal finish box for the Syd-Hbt/Melb-Hbt races) and finishing at either Gordon or Garden Island in the Huon river in the early hours of the morning (followed by a motor up the Huon river to Port Huon to tie up - it is usually very cold and fog bound at this stage). The start is spectaular being in the dark with nav lights everywhere (this is a cat 5 race).
The second race is a pursuit race around Port Huon starting around 13:30pm on Saturday avro (usually after very little sleep and quite a few ales). Then some serious socialising over Saturday night.
Then the third race starts aroiund 9am on Sunday and finishes right back down at the mouth of the Huon river, followed by a long trip home back to Hobart (the winners can be those who nurse their hangover best, or are still fired up enough to run thier biggest kite in more breeze than normal!).
The series has been going now for around 30 years and remains popular despite the usually frigid weather in the Huon river!!
I only got to do the overnight race this year (on a half tonner called "Conquistador" - a Knoop 30 Hobart designed and built boat)and had to drive back so I could start work on nightshift on Saturday night. My partner Louise raced the full weekend and was in fine form by the time they made it back to Hobart tonight at around 5:30pm!
If you ever get the chance, come down and do it. |
Leigh Ex E30 MkII "Caroline" Hobart |
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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
Posted - 22 September 2005 : 7:49:51 PM
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Thank you Leigh for your input on the safety harnesses. Yesterday I went down to Whitworths & looked at their gear & got the full sales pitch. It looks like the Stormy Seas is the way to go. My next question is about instruments. I have been challenged by Kevins' experience about making all future purchases compatible. I would like to buy a GPS with repeater as well as an autohelm in the next year & was wondering what you have on the Caroline?
Chris. |
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david_eastwood
Main Sheet Hand
124 Posts |
Posted - 22 September 2005 : 10:00:36 PM
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Chris, to pitch in gratuitously: I have dealt positively with a bloke called Guy Oliver in the past who's right across electrics and instrumentation in general. My current contacts suggest he remains an excellent operator, he's working for a friend at present. Guy also has an excellent handle on the world of GPS. Numbers: 0419 333 403 or 9873 3691. I don't know if he is an agent for any particular manufacturer or distributor or not - worth checking to understand the objectiveness of his advice - remember this is the marine industry we're dealing with here...
I just bought some Navman gear from "Everything GPS" in Rozelle. They seemed good to deal with. I've used Navman stuff quite a bit - it seems pretty good and simple. I'm also looking to buy a repeater for the mast, but theirs seems a bit exxy. Any simple NMEA repeater should do it. Raymarine is OK too, B&G is way overpriced for what it is IMHO.
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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
Posted - 23 September 2005 : 4:33:55 PM
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Well there has not been time this week to paste the photos & comparison article between the Mark 1 & 2 E30s'which I had threatened. Have been sick & too busy at work. Never mind will hopefully get some time to fire questions at Reg at the regatta next weekend. Questions like - How many Mark 1 vs 2s' were built, did he build all the boats & to what extent. Is there any concrete in the keels. Are there line drawings available, how is the keel attached to the hull, & so on...?
Can we get a copy of the names of E30s he built & who were they sold to so that we can make a register & chase these boats up.
Do youaaall have any questions?
Chris. |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 23 September 2005 : 4:53:36 PM
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Re Navman gear, I have heard of another sourse of very reasonally priced product.
Apparently via the Internet in the good old USofA. Will get the link over the weekend. A mate of mine with a S&S 30 replaced all his electronic with new Navman and I am not sure how much but it was sounded very cheap to me.I think worth following up.
cheers. |
"Splinter" |
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Chris Cope
Skipper
Australia
2350 Posts |
Posted - 23 September 2005 : 5:16:54 PM
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To be honest, I do not know very much about these new toys and I think? the stuff we do have on board is old Navman depth sounder, log & mast head speed instuments. I will take some photos this weekend. There are no brands, as I have given them a good looksee a few weeks ago. Rod has been playing with them & downloaded some literature to re-callibrate the wind instruments, but our gear is an older version. The direction and wind speed are all out of kilter & the log is also dodgy, sometimes it is correct & at other times it is a knot over what the hand held reads.
Chris. |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 23 September 2005 : 5:37:09 PM
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Sounds good Chris, you are flying by the seat of your pants as well. I don't have wind so the good old wet finger in the wind.
Makes you sail a lot better if your not looking a the electronic all the time (I think) would love to have it but cannot afford it at present.
Log is the most important but where you are sailing you would not hit bottom. Just remember the draft is 1.7 meters
I use the GPS most times for speed not the log, as we have it up on the Repeater. The only time I want to utilise the log is when I'm in current and trying to get out.
Let's have a look next weekend over a beer.
cheers, |
"Splinter" |
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david_eastwood
Main Sheet Hand
124 Posts |
Posted - 24 September 2005 : 3:14:00 PM
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Chris, variability in the log like that is usually due to binding of the impeller - basically it's sticking or popping out of alignment. alternately, rust on the axle, marine growth etc etc are also likely culprits. Answer is a new impeller - you can get them easily, cheap, and they come with a new axle. On the Navman gear I've seen it's a simple push fit into the housing and the new model impellers are "backward compatible" with older models I've come across. It's pretty rare for there to be an electronic reason for that sort of log behaviour.
I know a very helpful techie/product engineer at Navman here in Sydney who has helped me out in the past, can even be persuaded to come to boat and fix things in return for a sail and beer. Let me know if you want to sound him out (he's a good sailor too, by the way). |
Shed boy #1, the one holding the stick thingy. |
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david_eastwood
Main Sheet Hand
124 Posts |
Posted - 24 September 2005 : 3:20:53 PM
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| Kevin - interestng to see how we all do things differently. I just bought a log for my '26 because on the boats I race the log is the #1 instrument used sailing the boat upwind. Theory is that speed through the water is the prime measure of whether the boat is set up right and tracking. Too fast - and you're too low, too slow and you're too high, or trim is out, or the boat has just stalled or hit a wave. I know on the 40 footer I race offshore we sail the boat on a well understood set of polars, and keep it in a +/- 0.2knot window upwind. Wind angles can be deceiveing for a pile of reasons, so I agree it's important not to get obsessed by those. |
Shed boy #1, the one holding the stick thingy. |
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LCJOHNSTON
Helmsman
Australia
258 Posts |
Posted - 24 September 2005 : 6:11:01 PM
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Chris - to answer your question about "Caroline".
I have Autohelm instrumants on board - the Tridata (Speed/Depth/Temperature), Wind and tiller steering all link together over the "Sealtalk" data comms. This means that I can get true as well as apparent wind on the wind instrument and also the tiller steering can steer to an apparent wind angle or a compass heading. My Garmin fixed GPS does not link with these at present, howvere I am informed you can get a "black box" to get it to work with the Autohelm stuff. If you do this, you can tramsmit route information to the tiller steering so it can take you there itself! I think I would prefer to do it myself!. My mate has an Autohelm GPS he bought recently - it connected straight onto the "Seatalk" network and has the added bonus of being able to display all of the data off the other instruments (acts as a repeater as well as linking in to tell the pilot what to do). I am sure all other brands are capable of this sort of stuff by now as well. |
Leigh Ex E30 MkII "Caroline" Hobart |
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Splinter
Helmsman
Australia
500 Posts |
Posted - 25 September 2005 : 5:37:12 PM
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Dav/Chris, when I installed the Tridata, I positioned the skin fitting with the wheel so I could get to it easy. We remove it each time we use the boat. So it is always clean.
I also agree that you should not completely rely on intruments, but there are times when they are very handy. Saturday we were having a good race with a Spinnaker run from Port Hacking to Yellow mark in Botany Bay, (handicap start and we started off 6 min) We rounded the mark in Botany Bay in front and came out of the Bay in second spot. We were working back off Cape Bailey and the wind we dieing off and came in too close to the cliff and got stuck in a heap of distrubed air of the cliff. I think wind gear at that stage may have been saying get of there.
We came in 13th out of 28 starters. Great day.
cheers, |
"Splinter" |
Edited by - Splinter on 26 September 2005 08:20:12 AM |
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A New E30
