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 Considering an E28
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sovereign
Deck Hand

Australia
2 Posts

Posted - 18 February 2007 :  10:15:08 PM  Show Profile  Visit sovereign's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi All

I am considering purchasing an E28 and have seen one for sale at Drummoyne for $27500. I do not know the boat's name.

I have read many of the posts on the forum and I am impressed by the community and the advice being given. Are there any drawings or pictures of the underwater profile of the E28. Are there any special things to look for beyond those that are common to all boats.

David Hutchings

David
Helmsman

Australia
232 Posts

Posted - 19 February 2007 :  08:31:03 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
David,
The E28 at Drummoyne would be mine (Bon Doobie).

If you look in forums under 28 class the open a topic named below waterline there are photo's of the boat when i bought her a couple of years ago.

Any questions let me know, there are others on this forum who know the boat, Adrian (Imperium) has known this boat for years and the previous owner. Sacha has had the pleasure of sailing on her at the 40th regatta, they both have great knowledge on what to look for in an endeavour as do lots of others in the endeavour association.

She had all new standing rigging in Nov 06 and has just has the engine serviced, and a new headsail.

When you narrow down the boats that you are looking at your welcome to take her for a sail, or come out for a race, maybe line up a twighlight.

David.


If vegeterians love animals, why do they eat their food?
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Sasha
Helmsman

838 Posts

Posted - 19 February 2007 :  08:41:50 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The E28 has the lowest headroom of any of the endeavours...so it suits short sailors best. The reason for this is that the engine lives in front of the mast under the V berth and thus the drive shaft runs pretty much the length of the cabin in the bilges. This means the floor sits a little higher then with other endeavours.

Also, of the four I have now been aboard, two have rudders that protrude way out the back, while two have foil-type rudders that seem to have better manners about maintaining personal space. The big rudders are certainly nice in some conditions, but I remember it being a mild nightmare to back out of a crowded raft-up for fear of snapping off the rudder against someone elses boat. Not a huge deal, but still... I cannot tell you a personal take ont he sailing characteristics of the foil type rudders as I was rail meat on one boat and a guest on board while moored on the other.

Downstairs, the boats vary greatly, Bon Doobie is all open plan and spacious(You can repack a spinnaker below decks...apparently while other crew are playing doubles tennis). At the other extreme Scotch Mist has a lot of furniture below decks. A lot. For day to day living I have to say I prefer the sparse and open plan, but if I was sailing to New Zealand, id take the storage layout and tight quarters of Scotch Mist (Ocean boats are built with delibertaly narrow walkways and such so that there is "not far to fall" in case of knockdown or other sudden shake-up.

The 28's have a really pleasing shape and look like the old IOR racing era boats, while being strongly made and comfortable to sail (As opposed to many of the IOR era boats). Personally, and this is a strictly personal view, the deal breaker for me is not the engine under the V berth or the lowered headroom...it is the lack of afterdeck and huge storage area behind the cockpit as found on the 26's and mkII 24's (MkI 24's had the top locker but not the very useful side lockers, still had the afterdeckthough).

I find the lack of this area in both the 28's and 30's really problamatic. I have grown very fond of it on the 26's and would not soon give up the conveniences it offers.

Things to watch for include rigging, some people have had "notions" and some of the e28's I have seen have very "evolved" rigging layouts that Reg would just shake his head at.

Front hatch...as with all endeavours, there is a salt water shower head directly above the pillows in the V berth, and it is called the hatch cover.

Engine controls. The E28 in particular suffers a bit from problems with engine control cables. This is because they need to be so long that wear and friction issues multiply rapidly. Not a big problem, but an occassional annoyance.

That's about what comes to mind. They are by any standard at all a very nice boat, but as with any boat, you first need an idea of what you want it for and what you like doing. Only then can you assess the boat as to its suitability for your specific needs.

Example; If you like hanging out and partying in the cockpit with friends then the e28 may not be a great choice, it has the smallest cockpit area of all endeavours. If you want a sea boat that lets you go coastal cruising then the small cockpit is an advantage and the room it yields translates to a bigger cabin area....

If you want to carry a dinghy on the foredeck then you may be looking at a different boat as the foredeck of the 28 is pretty cluttered with rigging, if on the other hand you want a machine that you can take out on a 35 knot day and feel secure about coming home with the mast still in place then the E28 offers a solid choice (depends on some of the "evolved" rigging past owners may have done, mind you)

and that is how you asses a boat for characteristics of fitting in with what you want to get out of sailing. The trickiest part is to be honest in your statements of what you want to do and what is important to you. Most people try to be all noble and purist, and end up with a boat that meets those needs, but makes them miserable in lacking the comforts and ammenities that they really want but did not list because that is not what a "real sailor" wants.

Anyway, got to go. I want to do some welding on something before it gets too damn hot.

Sasha




_
The more I know about horses, the more I love sailboats.
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sovereign
Deck Hand

Australia
2 Posts

Posted - 20 February 2007 :  7:59:09 PM  Show Profile  Visit sovereign's Homepage  Reply with Quote
David and Sasha

Thanks for the great feedback and the offer of a sail. Still some wife-convincing to do before we make the jump. She has only had experience in multihulls and needs some explanation about boats that heel!

David
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Sasha
Helmsman

838 Posts

Posted - 20 February 2007 :  8:50:20 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The thing you may wish to mention is that if any monohull was "ideal" for easing a multi-hull sailor over to the light side, the endeavours are pretty much it. Yes they heel...but not that much. They are not a pregnant guppy shape, or an oversized surfboard below waterline. They are a deep displacement hull which heels and starts "working" at only about 5 degrees of lean. The most she will go over, when overpowered and with one rail buried in the water is about 15 degrees, given that they are a fairly narrow boat compared to the modern "floating jayco caravan" design of small racer/cruiser the 15 degrees of heel is enough to be a bit exciting but not at all unsafe.
After test driving about 6 types of boats, we got on board an endeavour and after ten minutes my wife said "This One"...which made bargaining on price a little difficult. As it turned out, she meant "this type" rather then that specific hull, but she was more then passionate about the desicion. The Endeavour made her feel safe. As in go from a zero start to discussing how it would be fun to try sailing across Bass Straight type of safe.

Personally I was never so terrified as when I was on a 30 foot catamaran doing 15 knots in a bit of a cross swell and one hull kept punching its way out of the waves before the other. A luna park ride based on the sensations this generated just might make a fortune, but not from me.

My advice would be to take up the offer of crewing a race or two on Bon Doobie. Then organise a test sail where your wife comes and you have enough experience of the systems to show her around properly and encourage her to make it her own.

Not that I am all that keen on David no longer having Bon Doobie, I think he will miss her if she sells, and I certainly want to go racing on board her again!
:)

Sasha

_
The more I know about horses, the more I love sailboats.
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Aaron
Deck Hand

Australia
3 Posts

Posted - 10 September 2007 :  3:25:11 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey David and Sasha!

I bought Bon Doobie!!

She now lives in Pittwater and will hopefully trounce the local twighlight competition.

One question..... What year was she manufactured? I need to know for clubmarine insurance. I went looking for this info and found these comments!

She is a BEAUTIFUL hull. I have recently antifouled her and painted the top sides gleaming white. The cabin tops are about to go white, with grey on the non skid bits. And the mast and boom will be glossy black before too long. I love her. I might even sell my kids on ebay in order to spend more time enjoying her.

We have chased the last of the winter series races around the bay. Starting more than five minutes after the appropriate catagory (of 25 or so boats) we finished within the top five every time.

Where do I find another cover for the salt water shower above the V-berth?

The layout is perfect and as a small family, with twilights in mind, She will get plenty of use.

Feel free to reply for some photos.... or a sail.


Aaron.


p.s. would you be offended if I told you I intend to change her name?
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Sasha
Helmsman

838 Posts

Posted - 10 September 2007 :  5:17:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Your plans sound great. Changing boat names is your priveledge, you will find many endeavours that have metamorphosed at least two or three times.

I just have one slight thought for you to consider with regards your plans.

I love black masts too. I think they look really sharp and great...but unfortunately, I have sort of come to the conclusion they may nto be a great idea.

We all know black heats up faster and gets hotter then, say, a white mast.

I thought the worst this would mean is that when you needed to go forwards and grab the mast to adjust something or other it would be a little toasty. I could live with that.

But even better then the way a black mast makes an endeavour look is performance, and part of performance for us was going over to all-spectra halyards. Spectra is brliiliant stuff! Cannot praise it highly enough (as long as it is the three-layered version that has the anti-creep matrix in it, and not the cheaper older-gen stuff still being made in China and sold on ebay). But the achilie's heel of Spectra fibre is heat. It does not like being cooked and has a "relatively" low tolerence for it.
This is normally not a huge issue as the friction on anything less then a Volvo Ocean Racer as the line runs through the winch will not generate that kind of friction/heat.

But solar-baking it for years and years inside a tall black chimney called your mast suddenly started seeming like a bad idea. So I checked the numbers.
basically, you could get away with it in Melbourne (though I chose not to) and Sydeny is marginal (mind you, it is based on some real gueswork for the inside of the mast getting about 15degrees C hotter if it was painted black) and sticking a digital probe thermometer up my white mast on a really hot day and recording the temps across a few intervals of a ten hour day.

So my figures might be out and you might be safe to do it...but I thought I would share some reasoning that led me to forsake the black aluminium mast notion. (By the way, actuall carbon-fibre masts have very different heat transferal characteristics then aluminium)

Sasha


_
The more I know about horses, the more I love sailboats.
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Greg Lowe
Administrator

Australia
217 Posts

Posted - 10 September 2007 :  5:39:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Aaron,

Congratulations and welcome aboard.

Which club are you racing with? We at Gosford, have a joint race program with the RMYC called the Good Fellowship or 4 Pack series. It is a lot of fun. I hope to see you around the waterways.
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Chris Cope
Skipper

Australia
2350 Posts

Posted - 10 September 2007 :  6:06:48 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hullo there Aaron,
Welcome to the Big Endeavour Yacht fraternity and congratulations on your purchase. The Bon Doobie is a great racing as well as cruising boat as she has proved over the years. In fact all three of the E27, E28 & E30 yachts are very competitive in mixed fleets as well as against the E24's & E26's.
We sail the Hagar IV, an E30 out of North Harbour SC. Looking forward to racing with you at the next Endeavour Regattas, Drummoyne in October & the Nationals up at Lake Macquarie in January 2008.
Chris.
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Aaron
Deck Hand

Australia
3 Posts

Posted - 12 September 2007 :  01:23:01 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Firstly, Hello to Greg and hello to Chris, thankyou for your welcoming comments. There are still gentlemen.

I plan to show the my friends the back of Bon Doobie, or her new name, over the following season in the woody point races. Check out the web address: http://www.wpyc.com.au/ We could meet up Greg!

Secondly.... Thankyou Sasha for your wisdom. You know your Sh.t.

I don't know if I can de-rig the girl in order to do a propper job on the stick, as dollars are the stuff that keep you in, or out, of a marraige sometimes. For sure I would love to send the pointy bit pearly white, so it's easier to see from my balcony, not to mention I prefer the look. However It's lack-luster can be best overcome, I think, with a good dose of the bosun's chair, a careful brush, and a tin of gloss black.... temp. be damned (atleast untill next time).

Any way... I feel welcomed by your community, and thanks. If I can be of any help then sing.

p.s. I can get GREAT RATES on slipping, you just need to be able to get to Pittwater and be prepared to swing a scraper.


Aaron.
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Aaron
Deck Hand

Australia
3 Posts

Posted - 12 September 2007 :  01:57:16 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Oh yeah.....

Any ideas on the year of manufacture?

Aaron Perkins. 0405 200 732
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akeir
Helmsman

Australia
269 Posts

Posted - 12 September 2007 :  11:58:13 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Aaron I just checked out the Woody Point website, I love the constitution, I like the requirement for a quorum to be one member and one bottle of champagne, however beer could substituted in times of finanacial hardship. The other item I liked was that the club was not to accumulate assets apart from a temprite.

Now that is a club!!!!


Owner of Charissa
Pictures at http://s154.photobucket.com/albums/s255/akkeir/Charissa/
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akeir
Helmsman

Australia
269 Posts

Posted - 12 September 2007 :  2:29:15 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I love this yacht club... I just checked out the sailing instructions .. This is the instructions relating to protests and I quote:

Protests are not encouraged however anyone with a problem, and accompanied by two cases of beer, may approach the start boat where the protest will be heard and possibly dealt with.

Should this approach be incorporated into the next National Titles?

Cheers
Andrew

Owner of Charissa
Pictures at http://s154.photobucket.com/albums/s255/akkeir/Charissa/
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Greg Lowe
Administrator

Australia
217 Posts

Posted - 13 September 2007 :  5:36:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think these rules should definitely be adopted for the Drummoyne Regatta, I volunteer to be on the Protest Committee.

Aaron, I will let you know when we are heading into Pittwater next, we spent last Friday night there and had an excellent time at the Newport Arms preparing for an offshore on Saturday.
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